Former Supreme Court Associate Justice Antonio Carpio said police were fully aware of what former president Rodrigo Duterte meant when he repeatedly used the term “neutralization” during the implementation of Oplan Tokhang.

Carpio made the remarks in an interview with DZMM, disputing claims raised during Duterte’s pre-trial proceedings at the International Criminal Court in The Hague last Thursday.

On the third day of proceedings, Duterte’s lead counsel Nicholas Kaufman argued that the former president did not direct authorities to “kill” drug suspects. Kaufman said the repeated use of “neutralization” during the Duterte administration referred to “lawful restraint,” citing a 2017 statement from former Philippine National Police chief Ronald Dela Rosa that the term meant “arrest.”

“The term neutralization itself is of course not defined, anywhere, in any of these documents as meaning to kill,” Kaufman stated.

Carpio rejected that interpretation, saying law enforcement officers understood the operational meaning of the term within the broader context of Duterte’s public pronouncements.

“You have to take that in the context of also what former President Duterte has been saying publicly at the time, sabi niya ‘kill, kill, kill, pag ayaw lumaban bigyan mo ng baril para lumaban at patayin mo',” he stated.

Carpio also disputed Kaufman’s assertion that “neutralization” referred to self-defense in situations where officers faced danger during operations.

He emphasized that Duterte was encouraging officials to pull the trigger, noting that the former president had suggested he would pardon personnel charged with murder in connection with the campaign.

The defense’s position that Duterte was not serious in his statements has been a recurring theme in the proceedings, with Kaufman arguing that some of the former president’s remarks were not meant literally.

Carpio said that argument does not hold, pointing to Duterte’s sworn testimonies before the Senate and the House of Representatives.

“Hindi totoo yan, dahil sa senate and house hearing under oath, seryoso yun…may camera, may transcription, may transcriber, at tsaka sinasabi mo ‘I will tell the truth and nothing but the truth’ under oath. Pano mo sabihin na joke lang yun, sinabi mo under oath eh,” he explained.

“Yun ang problema ni Duterte, hindi niya masabi na joke lang yun kasi inulit niya yan sa house hearing and the senate hearing,” he added.

Carpio also argued that the thousands of killings during Duterte’s term were not random, saying authorities operated with specific targets in mind.

“Yung random, lalabas yung pulis, maghanap sila ng kahit sino, eh eto pag labas nila sa presinto alam nila san sila pupunta eh. At tsaka may barangay list, remember the barangay list, kumuha yung mga barangay sino yung mga drug addict, mga drug peddlers…hindi yun random,” he stressed.

The ICC proceedings are ongoing.